Taking the .NET from ALT.NET

As I am still trekking on my path to development enlightenment I have recently subscribed to the altnetconf group hosted at Yahoo. To suggest that this is where the smart guys hang out would be a mild understatement.

When going to register, my eye was caught by the definition of the group.

ALT.NET - You're the type of developer who uses what works while keeping an eye out for a better way. - You reach outside the mainstream to adopt the best of any community: Open Source, Agile, Java, Ruby, etc. - You're not content with the status quo. Things can always be better expressed, more elegant and simple, more mutable, higher quality, etc. - You know tools are great, but they only take you so far. It's the principles and knowledge that really matter. The best tools are those that embed the knowledge and encourage the principles.

Now this is all pretty admirable stuff and I certainly agree with the general direction. But what are we saying when we adopt the best of any community. Does this mean we are open to adopting the principles of that community or are we encouraging the use of them as an alternative to .NET? In that case, I pose the question - is the .NET portion of the ALT.NET moniker even relevant?

Specifically addressing other technologies in the definition of this community seems wrong to me. And I was literally staggered that Scott Bellware is going to implement the altdotnet.org website in rails. This seems inappropriate at best. Egotistical and exclusive at worst. Scott states -

In my personal experience, Rails is the right technology for this
kind of project. This statement is in line with the alt.net values
as I understand them.

The technology choice isn't a political statement. Making political
statements through technology choices doesn't seem to be a good way
to make technology decisions.

Whether he cares to admit it or not this makes a statement to the community, particularly to those still looking to embrace this developing set of values. If I am a developer looking to make the leap to a new paradigm of development within my chosen technology I would be thoroughly confused by this decision.

Surely the creation of this new hub is the perfect opportunity to embrace and encourage new members of the community. I would expect it to be open source. I would expect it to take advantage of the kind of concepts that make ALT.NET so appealing to me and many others. ORM, IoC, TDD, MVC should be addressed and incorporated where appropriate. Not using this new application to showcase the core ideals of ALT.NET (emphasis now on .NET) is a missed opportunity to my eyes and one that I hope is not regretted.

Personal disclaimer: I'll admit it. I'm a lurker. I currently exist on the fringes of the community concept that is ALT.NET. Should I be more involved? Yes, probably. For now, however, I choose to comment from the sanctuary of my personal blog. One day I will have the confidence to integrate with the community and address my concerns directly. But for now, I am sheltered. Feel free to call me a coward.

kick it on DotNetKicks.com

October 26, 2007 09:34 by steven.burman
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October 26. 2007 15:09

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Taking the .NET from ALT.NET

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October 27. 2007 08:27

Kevin Isom

Yeah, but Bellware is one of the biggest problems with the Alt.Net community having a Anti .Net feel to it...The whole movement being fostered by some of the people in the community seems more ego driven development. There way is the only way if you doing anything else you are a Mort and should be looked down on and sneered at and joked about. I would have thought, and was hoping that they would be putting out tutorials, screencasts and what not to push the Alt.Net movement. Not talking about the problem developers aka "Mort", but what are the advantages to adopting some of the alt.net ways....How to introduce some of the methods into your current workplace...now that's not to say some of the community people aren't doing a good job of it....<a href="ayende.com/.../a> does an awsome job of it as well as a few others.

Kevin Isom

November 14. 2007 14:07

Scott Bellware

> I would have thought, and was hoping that they would be putting
> out tutorials, screencasts and what not to push the Alt.Net movement

er... I guess you missed the free workshops I've done around the country, and the user groups I've started, and the push to get this content into mainstream conferences like DevTeach?

Dude, because to push didn't come in your preferred format doesn't mean that it's not out there. We're all working quite hard at our day jobs, and we spend our time to communicate agile and open source practices -- in the way that suits our work styles and our schedules.

Scott Bellware

May 8. 2009 08:29

Liam McLennan

Adopting the best of any community is important because the Microsoft world can be so insular. ALT.NET is largely about taking ideas, principles and practices from other communities (mostly Smalltalk, Java and Ruby) and applying them to .NET.

Liam McLennan

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